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Eurovision Song Contest

ihno

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In Germany the General Broadcasting Companies of Germany (ARD) is responsible and they got a lot criticism over the last few years for a lot of decisions they made.

Now they have decided who is going to sing for Germany next year and they didn't fail to make a terrible decision again.

It's not that they nominated a rather homophobic rapper to be judge like they did last year. No, this is about the singer. They have selected a "Reichsbürger" this year.



Xavier Naidoo, crazy radical christian, homophobe and conspiracy theoretist.

- Mr. Naidoo thinks that the Federal Republik of Germany doesn't exist but is nothing but a commercial Agency (BRD GmbH) run by the US government ("Reichsbürger" movement). Now he says "I don't think that" but he gives speeches on the demonstrations of those. Well...
- Mr. Naidoo thinks that the "end is near" and the final day of judgement is close.
- Mr. Naidoo thinks that being gay is not natural.

So - as of today - Germany is going to be represented in a contest that is mostly supported by gay people by somebody, who a) depises gay people and b) thinks that Germany doesn't exist.
 
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haiducii

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They have selected a "Reichsbürger" this year.

Hugely disappointing. :sick: Another German entry to ignore!

How does a person who does not even believe that Germany is a "real country" want to represent this nonexisting state of Germany at the ESC? Can you represent something that in your opinion does not exist? :thinking: :thinking: :D :thinking: :thinking:
 

warp9

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Fact is : He has a lot of gay friends.
Fact is : Our government is a whore from the US-government
Fact is : He has a damn good voice (Even if I don't like most of his songs)

And yes : He spoke in front of the "Reichsbürger" - and has realized later, that is was a mistake. Did you never ever made a mistake ? So calm down. He has a big chance to win.
 

ihno

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Fact is : He has a lot of gay friends.

Yes, that is a standard argument.

Fact is : Our government is a whore from the US-government

It is a little more complicated and that is the problem with simplifications. I observe that Reichsbürger movement from a professional POV for some time. And that's just one aspect: even if that would not matter, there is still homophobia and antisemitism.

And we're not talking about RTL or something but a publically founded tv station. It's my money they use.

Fact is : He has a damn good voice (Even if I don't like most of his songs)

I never liked him so I know only a few. Don't like them either. :D

But is that a sufficient reason to avoid a televoting amongst different bands like they did last year? You know "die Söhne Mannheims" - Naidoo is involved with them. They faced a televoting in 2013 and didn't win.

If Naidoo was sent after a televote I would not mind as much.

And yes : He spoke in front of the "Reichsbürger" - and has realized later, that is was a mistake. Did you never ever made a mistake ? So calm down.

I am calm.

That "I was just coming along and didn't know what it was about" is just a story he told to the Stern afterwards.
You can find his speech on youtube and you'll certainly hear that it was not a casual "hello" like he said later.

Actually he spoke on several occasions for the Reichsbürger and friends. Like here in August 2014 (that is a different one from the one that's in the press).



This is wha the political magazine Panorama from the NDR writes:
http://anonym.to/?http://daserste.ndr.de/panorama/aktuell/Naidoo-Das-falsche-Signal,naidoo294.html
I guess they are calm.

He has a big chance to win.

I don't think so and that has nothing to do with him.

Remember that soul-guy Germany sent a while ago? Didn't win. And don't we hear that every year? But you never hear the "big chance" outside of Germany.

I can only repeat what I said last year. I don't think the NDR has the right approach. Great voices perhaps, but sitting around doesn't appeal to other countries.

I want silly constumes and hot muscle running in a spinng wheel like the Ukraine had. :thumbs up:

LLAP. ;)

@haiducii: watch the video, you can hear it there, what he says in public.
 

warp9

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Quote doesn't work, so I marked ihno's comments blue.

Yes, that is a standard argument.

I don't give a shit if it's a standard argument . It's true.

It is a little more complicated

No, it's not. It's just that simple.

And we're not talking about RTL or something but a publically founded tv station. It's my money they use.

And ? Let's try. It's my money as well.

I never liked him so I know only a few. Don't like them either. :D

In fact I like one song.

But is that a sufficient reason to avoid a televoting amongst different bands like they did last year? You know "die Söhne Mannheims" - Naidoo is involved with them. They faced a televoting in 2013 and didn't win.

He isn't just involved - he's the founder.

If Naidoo was sent after a televote I would not mind as much.

All our Televotes - exept Lena - failed.

That "I was just coming along and didn't know what it was about" is just a story he told to the Stern afterwards.
You can find his speech on youtube and you'll certainly hear that it was not a casual "hello" like he said later.

Actually he spoke on several occasions for the Reichsbürger and friends. Like here in August 2014 (that is a different one from the one that's in the press).




He's right.

This is wha the political magazine Panorama from the NDR writes:
http://anonym.to/?http://daserste.ndr.de/panorama/aktuell/Naidoo-Das-falsche-Signal,naidoo294.html
I guess they are calm.


Yeah, maybe they're too calm. LOL Once I was a Music editor and wrote about a "Kool Savas"-Album - well, in fact I have "massacred" it. You know, that all this "Gangster Rap" is a money machine ?

Yeah, he wants to talk to all the people, including "NPD" and " Reichsbürger". Why the hell not ? It's better to talk than to fight, isn't it ?



I don't think so and that has nothing to do with him.

Well, I do think so. ;)
 

ihno

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He's right.

Yeah, he wants to talk to all the people, including "NPD" and " Reichsbürger". Why the hell not ? It's better to talk than to fight, isn't it ?

That is not logical.

the video I posted above: If one watches those 55 seconds one will see that he is actually sharing their believes because he's saying them out loud on a stage.

So - logically speaking - If I share a view with someone and talk to him, I will not have a "discussion" or "fight" his view. I will agree to it. I will use the "talk" to enforce my own view.

So the argument that he just wanted to "talk" to Neonazis and Reichsbürger doesn't make empirical sense. It's just as unlogical as if I would assume that the "Pediga" demonstrants want to "discuss". They use the demo to enforce themselves in their already deeply founded views.

If you agree you seem to share their believes too: that Germany doesn't have a constitution and is still occupied.

Of course you're free to do that but this forum and this thread are not the right place to have a proper substanciated historical discussion.
 
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warp9

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That's right, this is not the place for it. I will send you (hope, I find it and it isn't deleted) an interview with a CDU-man about it. Might take one or two days. Then we can talk about it (in PMs, of course).
 

ihno

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That's right, this is not the place for it. I will send you (hope, I find it and it isn't deleted) an interview with a CDU-man about it. Might take one or two days. Then we can talk about it (in PMs, of course).

If it is about the Reichsbürger-Ideology or the question if Germany has a constitution etc. pp. or not you don't have to look for it.

I don't mean you personally with the following:

As for the Reichsbürgers I know them very well. Years ago - around 2008 - before I have even heard of the movement one of them has even called me. He wanted to discuss my scientific work about British Occupation Law and Constituational Law (Verfassungsrecht) with me. It took a while to understand what this was about but since then I observe that movement. That was not the only time that I had discussion with them.

I have learned one thing: I am a rationalist and can only have a discussion on a rational basis. And that means that I have to take the idea, that I can be wrong, seriously.
I can't discuss with naive positivists, who just don't share that idea. They have a construct that allows them always be right in the end.

If I have a discussion with a crazy christian and I show him a logial contradiction in his believes he will always answer with "God's ways are not be understand by us!"
If I talk to a Reichsbürger or other conspiracy theorists and I show him a rational contradiction in his believes he will simply call me naive or stupid or just include me into the conspiracy.

So the best I will do is send you a link to a website where you can find some posts of mine which deal with the topic in length and depth.
 

warp9

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Last sentence in this thread : I have absolutely nothing to do with those "Reichsbürger". PM is out.
 

ihno

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Last sentence in this thread

Hhhm, maybe it will be if the the big Eurovision fans open up a new thread for Eurovision 2016. :)

: I have absolutely nothing to do with those "Reichsbürger". PM is out.

I know and I never wanted to say something like that. So not not to have misunderstandings: I didn't want to imply anything like that. :cheers:

edit: After massive protests the german broadcast has decided to take back their decision (which they called "suggestion" btw). Naidoo will not represent Germany in 2016.
 
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haiducii

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Germany withdraws Xavier Naidoo from Eurovision 2016

edit: After massive protests the german broadcast has decided to take back their decision (which they called "suggestion" btw). Naidoo will not represent Germany in 2016.

Some of his lyrics have been described as anti-semitic and homophobic...

MORE HERE
 

ihno

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Some of his lyrics have been described as anti-semitic and homophobic...

MORE HERE

Thank you. I am noticing something about this article.

Read what Schreiber writes. No surprise that I'm not a fan of Naidoo (both his music and his irrational speeches) but I expect a "thank you."

Where is the "THANK YOU"??? Normally you would expect something like "Mr. Naidoo and I came to the conclusion that it would be best ... I want to thank Mr. Naidoo bla bla bla".

That is what I expect, not about a speech about "at all costs..."

It is very unfortunate how the station is dealing the matter.
 
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warp9

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Haiducii, lots of secretly gay Singers have homophobic lyrics (that doesn't mean, that Naidoo is gay ;) )

But tbh, I've never heard a Song from him with anti-semitic or homophobic lyrics (Don't know his work with Cool Savas, who is homophobic as hell) . But I know a gay Rapper, who does homophobic lyrics. For the money, he said. And Gangster Rap means a lot of money - but he isn't so successful. :devil:

I don't know Xavier personally, but some of the guys, who work with him a lot. No words about that from them. And they would talk about it, if this was true.

I think, he has a damn good voice. He's a damn preacher, that's right (lots of songs about god etc) but he has to sing. Politics should not be part of the ESC - but unfortunately it does ...
 

haiducii

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Politics should not be part of the ESC

Couldn't agree more with you. But as you said, unfortunately it's true. The ESC is often not really about the song but who your neighbours are.

loyal.jpg


Sad...because the ESC is a fun event, in which music and the understanding between European people should be the focus.
 
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