circumcision: Violation of Human Rights?

[Blacky94]

http://nullrefer.com/?http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/06/29/german-court-bans-male-circumcision/
http://nullrefer.com/?http://www.businessinsider.com/germany-circumcision-illegal-cologne-2012-6

In Cologne, Germany the circision of boys was forbidden.
Reason for this decision was the case of a boy who was hospitalized, because of faulty circision.

"According to the court ruling, "the fundamental right of the child to bodily integrity outweighs the fundamental rights of the parents."

"The child's body is permanently and irreparably changed by the circision. This change runs counter to the interests of the child, who can decide his religious affiliation himself later in life,"

Also many circisions, especially religious circision, are performed without anesthesia, which causes great pain to the victim and can even cause traumas.

The Jewish and Muslim community were outraged by this decision.

Helpful Links:
http://nullrefer.com/?http://www.circumcision.org/studies.htm
http://nullrefer.com/?http://www.sp...ate-court-s-circumcision-ruling-a-841276.html
http://nullrefer.com/?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circumcision

 

[Sinnerr]

Parents really shouldn't decide this for their children. Anyway I think only rational reason is health complications. But prohibition is not solution because if they couldn't let do this doc in hospital, they will do this at home with kitchen knife. Discussion and education is what people need.

 

[XMan101]

Well this is going to be one big can of worms - and I urge everyone who replies to be polite and objective in your views. It's created heated arguments before so please no personal insults.

I don't agree with it and never will. I've known people who have hated their parents for letting it happen, nothing that is non-reversible should ever be done to a child.

I know there are religious views but (and here is where I will get slated) religion to me is primitive and and it's pure political indoctrination. I'm an aethiest , not an aggresive sort, I listen to all views, but I don't believe in the sun god, or any other god, and no god has ever said cut off you foreskin!

For those who agree with this snip then think about the beliefs of those who believe it's right to cut out a girls clitoris, so she can never in her life enjoy sexual pleasure.

In males it might not be as bad, but it's still totally wrong to mutilate any child before they're old enough to decide for themselves.

No offence to any views, these are mine and nobody elses

 

[jeansGuyOZ]

Where's the poll option to say "I am so over this issue"?

 

[Blacky94]

I actually feel the same. I have been circised when i was a baby so I don't remember the pain, but i am still mad at my father because of it. I know he wanted only my best, but
he had no right to decide that.
well...I really envy uncut man

@jeansGuyOZ
If none of the poll options satisfy you then don't vote. And if you don't want to discuss that matter anymore then don't post here. Simple isn't it?

 

[peter123]

Letting all religious views out of consideration the law in a country is the yardstick.
By german law every surgical operation is first of all a body injury, which is only then no crime, if it is 1. medically indicated 2. conducted "lege artis" and 3. the most important fact: justified by legally effective informed consent of the patient.
These are the criteria, so for me the parents should and can and may not decide for their children.
The court could not make another decision, beeing bound to law.

 

[Hunklover]

Other than health issues which usually involves inflammation of the foreskin, I don't see the point in doing it. It exposes the glans to the environment all the time without any protection.

 

[bafm]

Being an atheist I can't really understand the religious reasons.

As said above, other than for health issues I don't see the point in doing it.
If we are born with foreskin then we should leave our foreskin as it is (IMHO of course)

 

[gb2000ie]

When religious rights slam into human rights, things invariably get heated and emotional.

On the one hand, you can have parents who believe that their kid will go to hell if they are given antibiotics, or not circised or what ever. On the other, you have the very life of the child hanging in the balance sometimes. In the case of circision you might argue that life of the child does not hang in the balance, but that's not always true. A few years ago there was a tragic case in Ireland where a religious circision went badly wrong and a boy died.

As a humanist, I don't think superstitions trump measurable reality. I don't know if your God exists, but neither can you! I do know that slicing off a bit of a boys penis is irreversible, and could go horribly wrong. It is, at best, a needless medical intervention, with the companying risks, but few if any gains.

If a kid has a medical need to be circised then of course all that changes, but to just slice off a big of someone's genitals for superstitious reasons, that strikes me as against the boy's rights.

Like the court ruling says, when guys reach adulthood they should be free to choose what religion to join, and whether or not to get bits of their anatomy removed for their chosen god. It is not up to parents to indoctrinate and mutilate their kids!

Whether or not to call it a violation of human rights I'm not sure, but I would definitely class it as child abuse.

B.

 

[freeat530]

to me it is mutilation of the human body bc it is essentially removing a part of the human body for no reason medical science has stated that there is very little difference between doing it and not doing it anymore.

 

[new_leitus]

you can not judge this kind of practice as a violation of human rights, as it is a religious decision and relatives. Although I do not agree that the child can not decide for himself as an adult.

 

[XMan101]

Where's the poll option to say "I am so over this issue"?

No decent person can ever be "over" this issue.

That is a totally crass comment without any thought involved.

 

[XMan101]

you can not judge this kind of practice as a violation of human rights, as it is a religious decision and relatives. Although I do not agree that the child can not decide for himself as an adult.

Are you actually saying that you agree with cutting off something from a baby is acceptable ?

I don't see how anyone could ever agree to that!

 

[redbones111]

No decent person can ever be "over" this issue.

That is a totally crass comment without any thought involved.

The same could be said of yours. You've just jumped to a conclusion based on absolutely no evidence whatsoever. That is totally not objective. I agree with jeans as I have debated this subject to death on other boards and it has always reached the same conclusion.

 

[XMan101]

I'll never see the permanent removal of a natural part of the body from a child as something acceptable.

 

[peter123]

Well this is going to be one big can of worms - and I urge everyone who replies to be polite and objective in your views. It's created heated arguments before so please no personal insults.

You are so rigth XMan, I also saw this problem comming by discussing such an emotional theme, so pleas all calm down and be factual^^

 

[Whisper]

My opinion is that everyone should have the right to decide what is done to their bodies.

And XMan, I agree with you, although I'll add little more: who has the right to decide that young girl's clitoris and part of the labium are cut off, sewed almost closed leaving little hole for "daily needs" and to be opened again when girl gets married? I'm sorry guys about this sidetrack to female side but all this mutilation, to men or to women, done in the name of religion is cruel IMHO.

Still, let's try and keep this thread polite (now I sound like a school teacher )

 

[peter123]

Still, let's try and keep this thread polite (now I sound like a school teacher )

No, you don't sound so, you are right, discussing such emotional themes is always difficult....and sometimes unfortunately not really productive.....:thinking:

 

[Sinnerr]

Many people in this world think that their children are their property, that generally parets own kids. It looks mad, but this parents was also kids what was owned by their parents...

... brutal murders as punshimen for pullution of prestige of family like pre-marriage sex, convertion to other religion, homosexuality ... or non-punishment but just tradition of womens circision (!) ...

From this perspective isn't boy's circision from religious reasons so bad. But principle is same like in case of girls.

Many people think that love means Holy Bible or Koran or Torah or ... . I would say that greatest love is to let loved people go their own way. Sad but true. Religion is the opium of the people. Sad but true. But many people don't understand it. Sad but true.

 

[bigsal]

Thank you all for having revived the issue.

I have already expressed my opinion, and I repeat it is my opinion, in other previous posts, but I'm happy to repeat it.

This questionable practice (but I could to use a term more "stronger"), is the result of ancestral beliefs and religious traditions, which no longer have a reason to exist.

We realize that this is an irreversible surgery. Once a cut is not going back.

Many prefer to bury their heads in the sand.

Not the brave German court that a judgment exemplary, wished to safeguard the child's right to decide for himself when will an adult.

The right to worship and religion should not affect the personal choice of the individual.

Without rights there is no freedom of choice.